All Up In: Pilates & Sobriety with Katie Tomaszewski of Deep Line Health

Music. Welcome to all up in my lady business I am your host Mary nisi on this podcast all explore the fine line between having it together I'm losing your shit here I share my journey as an entrepreneur a mom a wife a DJ and randomly a beekeeper I have no shame and no filter except the ones I use on Instagram my stories of resilience a little structure and a lot of resource Wellness can show you how to take those same things and live your life with your hole. Music. On today's episode I have my first guest my friend Katie thomashefsky no thomashefsky thomashefsky thomashefsky we get into the pronunciation of her crazy polish name in the episode but she is a GD Force we tackle issues of single Parenthood and Entrepreneurship and how they pandemic was good for her business. That makes one of us and how a silver reset that she took years ago turned into a business opportunity that is now taking the World by storm it is very hot right now to be sober. Or silver curious She also asked some business questions about hiring support staff and we got into that a bit as well this was super fun. Super super fun so without further ado. Very excited today to have my very first interview today we've got one of my near and dear Rider dies Miss Katie thomashefsky I said that right you did really well I didn't even prep you I was thinking I should take it's so funny my husband John you know him you're Felix's work he got whenever you call me or text me was damaged s he was takes off the ski as if that somehow making it diminutive it's Thomas Chef oh believe it or not yeah. What's amazed W is like a wait say it again Thomas Chef thomashefsky yeah tell my chesky tell me I usually do chesky which is pretty good so I just let it go it's in your head now so Thomas chefs tell my shit like a chef yeah that Tom a chef ski oh wow there's a lot of lot of verbs yeah announce a new with it. Can you tell my chefs key is the founder of deep-lined Health a wellness company based right here in Chicago combining her formal training and Health Sciences and movement education with her own personal life experiences Katie began coaching habit change in 2018 when she launched her 90-day sobriety challenge called Dynamics after losing her day job like oh so many people in the spring of 2020 Katie moved her virtual side hustle into her whole ass main hustle and opened a virtual Wellness studio called Deep Line Health in the spring of 2020 which specializes in personal development through movement meditation and breath work you can catch Katie live in Chicago this summer when you join her and you will for her whim hop inspired ice bash event a truly unique social experience fueled. By movement music and cold exposure when Katie's not busy radicalizing Drinkers and coaxing people into ice bath so you can find her at home and Humboldt Park relaxing with her teen daughter reading chatting for hours and Marco Polo exploring Vegan Cooking cause she's a half-assed vegan and navigating the Chicago dating scene and procrastinating on doing her taxes while Mass nuts. They're just like us. Welcome Katie thank you Mary I'm so excited to be here I really happy to have you here today so Katie why don't you give my dozens of listeners a peek behind the curtain and telling us about your origin story how did you become. The kitty Tom and Chef Seth ski that we all know how did I become this well I'll keep it brief but I became Knocked Up in college and I was finishing my degree in nutrition science and there was an internship involved to get licensed which I couldn't do because I had the baby and it was just I just it was all I could do just to finish school so then I took a break was momming her and then me and Dad split and shortly after that she was about to I started getting real antsy about my figure and wanting to date and all the things so I bit the bullet and bought into some Pilates which I like. Frankly could not afford I see you bought into Pilates what do you mean by that you know I didn't know about anything about Pilates other than the Jennifer Aniston thing and it just seemed like something that was for very wealthy people is like I just it's not for me I was actually looking I was pricing liposuction and my friends like will forget to do that I mean try Pilates it's just as expensive and I was like all right I found a deal at a studio that I then later later certified at and I just I kind of had this thing where like either I need to figure out how to make a lot more money or I need to just be a teacher and if it was what I you know as in the wellness world and actually was more in alignment what with what I wanted to do I got into nutrition and didn't realize it was going to be so clinical so symptom focused I wanted to help people's feel better live better and it wasn't really about that so I put the Pilates in as a placeholder ended up loving it what you're saying is you started taking Pilates classes and realized you loved it so then you'd be then you started to go toward certification yeah more so just because I wanted to be able to do more Pilates and I thought well this will lead me somewhere at the time I was working in restaurants and that was really tough with a kid I've had some rough situations in restaurants as a mother not exactly a supportive industry of the. Not exactly a supportive industry a general yeah so sadly you know I was making great money but it just it was really stressful and I was stressed out all the time and I was always yelling and pissed off and you know when I went to Pilates I was cool for like 2 to 3 days after. Not only were my abs getting you know I felt myself sort of like you know like I put myself in the dryer and came out a little fresher but I was like wow I'm like way less. So that's when I really went into that because at the same time I was starting therapy and trying to figure out my end of the dissolution of the relationship with my daughter's father and it was just very supportive of that and so I'm teaching Pilates loving Pilates getting deeper and deeper in it I start teaching online in 2017 randomly when we have like a polar vortex or something like that and people in the Pilates Community gave me some shade about it like you know that's a real Reckless of you you can't like you can't correct somebody right there this is a Hands-On there C curve is more of a. Straight line you're not yeah because of me Pilates teachers can be amazing and then they can also be a different kind of way and so there's there's there's a thing in the industry and I kind of at some point want like because I was a single mother because I was literally desperate for cash I was like I can't really play this game with y'all like I don't really care anything I have a skill people are paying me for it so peace peace be with you I'm not trying to win you I'm doing I'm doing me. And so it to the point where like I'd even have a some teachers where I. I knew if they gave me shade that I was on a good day I got a good idea going this is good yeah I mean people don't usually like change and if they're reactive about it then that means there's something there yeah it's not just like Katie's ruin the industry it's like it's you know wait a minute because then all here's the thing when you start innovating and changing and make in doing new things with things people are like wait a minute but my way is the way. And if you make this other way then I have to learn that other way yeah and the last thing I want to do is change. So if you invest so much in One Direction and I think it's really it's part of our binary thinking that is just a plague of everything that there's one way like no no bring that way over here we're just adding to the to the to the Sunday we're putting sprinkles on top now it's just another tool it's like we're not threatening your tool well yeah I remember when we because we were on CDs forever as if CDs or this like dignified like method of providing music to the world and we were I started off I lost started off on the final and then I moved to CDs and I started becoming a mobile DJ and then when we we as a company decided like okay we need to move to Serato because people are beginning to look at us like we're old fogies because we're using CDs I remember the first wedding I did when I was on a laptop it was like I was so obviously looking for things and searches people wouldn't think that I was like phoning it in even though it's. It's so stupid very funny so I had some all this insecurity that I would feel like I look like less of a DJ because I was at live mixing everything and like you know whatever anyway yeah why are you paying me when you could just have an iPod yeah yeah yeah but it's not I mean it's a lot more work than that for sure and that's so that's people there were all these free videos on YouTube and whatever but here's the thing. I don't do that shit I need to be present I need somebody there even if I'm not particularly getting picked apart on every minutiae of my exercise showing up for an appointment it works for me different than watching a video so I knew if I was like that other people might be like at two so I just plowed forward with it at the same time I was trying to go viral with these Park exercises I was doing got about paying for it was really fun Park Core lots of like wild stuff you can do with swing that's what she said but it's not like that although there's a lot of similarities of Pilates very easy on the sexual innuendo yeah is there's a lot of stuff that could be taken in very funny ways but I will say when you were doing this park are there do this Parkour videos still a bit exist on they do they exist there so you can find on YouTube but actually if you want to look at them go on Instagram at part Court TV I will say they were it made it was one of these things where I'm like I would love to run into Katie when I'm at a park because it would force me to exercise and I could get it out of the way while. Sebastian's rolling around in dirt I mean people stared and that's another thing where like that came because of motherhood because I was just trying to make this work I'm at the park I was trying to get my daughter into a gymnastics class that was a level up because it worked with my work schedule and they are like she has to do these tricks so I was like all right well I can teach her these tricks I had to get her ABS warm so I was like here you know she's like seven I'm like trying to get her to do stuff on the on the swing and tricking her it's like fun kids won't do Pilates you know you have to have to be an activity that's that's playful and So within that I was like damn like I am very much feeling this and so I was like I'll just make some videos I had started writing a Blog and I was just looking at content and so I started making these videos and I started getting them more and more produced and they're fun and they were fun and then at some point. Wow that was a part of my sort of my business journey and what year is this this is I think I just did parkour is a 2017 it was right when yeah because I just aged 35 I had decided to take six months off alcohol because was not getting ahead of my business and I had all these ideas and I just couldn't get the like I could I was always distracted in my head tired and part of that was because I'd recover from the weekend till about Wednesday and then I had two days before the weekend again and I just didn't I wasn't moving forward at the pace I knew was possible so I decided to do the ultimate sacrifice take away alcohol what you know just tell alcohol like you're a yeah you it's me yeah I am so sorry I'm doing this to you I'm so sorry I'm doing this to my family and friends this is unkind of me it's ludicrous I was the only person I'd ever heard of at that time who gave up alcohol that wasn't forced to I remember when you did it and I was like good for you Katie I don't know why you're doing that you don't have a problem yeah people like you don't have to be this extreme. You're like have you met me and so yeah so I gave up alcohol and and and then in that process realize wow my anxiety and mood disorder I thought I had also went away when I was not constantly detoxing and so in that time I had started like kind of looking around and seeing that there were different kind of coaching programs going on and I wouldn't want to do a program on this mind-body syndrome I believe I told you about my buddies and you did you are the first person I had a an injury that would not go away the pain wouldn't go away and I core is strong my glutes are strong teaching Pilates every day and you said what's going on in your life I'm like I'm just in a court battle with my ex and you know like it's TMS just write a list of your stress it'll go away I was like that's cute but I'm not doing that you know I'm going to go to a body worker but it kept not working and I tried it and it went away and I was like people need to know about this you got so into TM I mean we're all being anybody still and I haven't actually discussed my chronic pain issue on this on this podcast yep it's coming yeah anyways I wanted to do something with that. Nobody cared about that I was screaming into a void no one wants to hear nobody wants to hear that their pain is. Possibly not a slipped disc or an old football injury or it's like the lynx people will go to not think psychologically about pain it's the same sort of stuff that kind of comes up when it comes to quitting alcohol as well oh yeah it's just like it can't be so simple and anyways there's there's a lot of reasons why and and part of it is even learning how to talk about it without offending people like you know they hear that you're telling them that they made themselves sick and you're like wait how do I explain this in a way that you stay open when it's not there and it's not they're making themselves sick it's ricocheting stuff that started so long ago in their lives they don't even realize that it's still having Butterfly Effect through there yeah nervous system yeah it's essentially you know what I think about TMS its anything that is a result of you not living in alignment with what your true needs are. It's when your mind which has been brainwashed to to cheer child providers Society whatever it is for you to show up in a certain kind of way to stay safe and your body's like you don't need to do that you don't need to worry 24 hours a day that you made the wrong choice by raising your child this way or that way you don't need to rush at all times and have a sense of urgency constantly running and then your backs like now taking you down because this is crazy you need to calm down so it's always a it's always Liberation on the other side of TMS there's always some sort of emotional Liberation that comes with it and every injury that I've had related has has been has been that way and so on that road what my people wanted was to know how I was still not drinking and how I could. Keep this up and by your people even your friends family yeah that I would spend hours you know one woman who ended up being in my first program she and I just started connecting because she's a stand-up comedian and she was on Instagram a lot and I was doing my stuff on Instagram a lot and we were talking about drinking and that's what really was the one that pushed me over because I was kind of counseling her a lot and I'm like you know what I should just see if there's a group that wants to get together January's coming up we'll see and I put a put a thing up at the Pilates studio I went on social media and I got nine people in my first group. And we went through 15 weeks at that time I did a 15-week program Now it's 12 and it was really successful and it was really powerful and so I went well I guess this is a thing that I should be doing and I use TMs principles so drinking the urge to drink is a function of anxiety. And anxiety is what happens when you're just that's your body Whispering there's a problem and then you're like shut up anxiety I'm going to get drunk and then lo and behold a number of years later you start flaring your injuries you start having skin rashes you start having chronic back pain or hip pain or sciatica or foot pain or whatever it is now just exactly so if you don't. Rush to cover the anxiety and you actually get what's behind the anxiety and make the changes everything feels easier including of course your anxiety is reduced so I look at drinking urges as a function of anxiety so a lot in a lot of ways Dynamics is it is an anxiety program having meditation based movement nervous system regulation all the things okay so you're so this is 2017 2018 is when I launched my first program it's basically 2019 because we started in gay so you're doing you're still teaching Pilates it's 2018 and 2019 you're starting your first time Dynamics program and people are hating me more than ever really talk about that what do you mean before hating you I mean the internet or your friends and family friends family internet because I was my Approach wasn't great at the beginning I was like don't you know come on stop drinking like I believe you two heard how can you still be drinking when I've already told you it's bad for you and so I had a real urgency again because I was seeing all the amazing changes for people and it was just like it wasn't getting in and I think when we get to getting to them or in what was it like my messaging wasn't in a way that people could hear got it you know and and I had to go on my own Journey. At two and so that's all been a part of this through teaching the program and just sort of How It's been humbling to figure out how to communicate with people in a way that they can actually receive it there's a lot of things there you know like just having the information is not the thing that makes communication work it's repetitive hearing things and having your brain being able to hear the messages and then. Understanding the messages and then once you first being even open yet getting somebody to a place where they even want to give you a chance at listening and if you if you shoot in there too fast you know you blow it yeah it's over then your invalid. Like in the idea of dissonance like I know that this is causing me more stress but I'd like to lie to myself and say I'm relieving my stress even though I looked at the science I understand hormones and I know that I'm actually holistically in my week causing more stress yeah this 20 minutes right now that my stress will be reduced or this little 20-minute pop of euphoria that alcohol gives me. I'm going to believe that that's the stress relief and that's the good part in my life is a thing that screwed up for me. Maybe I have mental issues I don't know and so yeah really kind of getting clear on what the alcohol is responsible for is really pretty amazing you can't unknow it once you experience it once you feel the clarity the pink Cloud all the wonderful things you can't really go back to drinking and not go it's just not what I it's like it's like if you got back together with your terrible ex you know too much and you're settling. And sometimes you have to settle right like no judgment sometimes you try and you're like I'm not ready I don't know how to be strong enough yet I don't know how to do this and enjoy it I desire alcohol too much it's too hard and that's right I think of sobriety as as like a yoga practice or a Pilates practice you're doing that your whole life once you decide this is where I'm going you're doing it your whole life to some degree. Maybe you just watch a YouTube video and practice for five minutes or maybe you go to class three times a week and at some point like you just went to Panama you go to Panama for two weeks and your yoga practice is forever changed that's what Dynamics is for your sobriety like I don't know if you're going to be sober after it I don't even know what that really means to be honest I have a lot of the word itself is heated for me but but it's part of the path there and it makes it easier and it's and it's a warm hug and it's a lot of education and strategy and reframing and it's great alright so it's 2018-19 you are starting Dynamics you're still teaching Pilates and how is dealing with your like your ex-husband and your daughter like how are how are your like how was your work life balance I mean my ex-husband will just say is not helpful as far as scheduling and different things like that so I've always had to finagle a career around chaos and that's one of the reasons that it's freaking hard to be your own in your own business but when it's harder to go to work and have a normal schedule that a. You know what worker would have that was harder and more stressful than the heart and stress that it was of creating this business that I really had. I'm not an addiction therapist you know I'm just I'm just a just a little girl and we all we all just little girls and and so you know thankfully weird fully in a way my life was so stressful that this was a better option and so I stayed with it and and I was able to let it

00 and she'd be fine like she was having issues she needed she needed to be out of school like she needed some one-on-one time and like don't we all but some kids manage it a little better than others so I I needed to figure out a way I could work a little bit at home and so this was my way. And then it was great she actually would say I love drain Amex I love when you teach Dynamics she thought it was interesting and cool hearing me talking to the computer and. Teacher you're incredible well I mean you really are actually was talking about you this morning to tell your have this amazing ability to like coach people will say weird things that get you exactly to go where you need to go. You know we're will be like you know find that gushy part on the left side of your body that sometimes squeezes together now think about that and then move your arm and you kind of added that's not an exact yeah no I hear what you're saying thank you did sort of sort of decode into in these odd ways and I will admit I think I might excellent excellent Pilates teacher and I have been in Pilates is life movement is life movement is Earth we are Earth bones are mountains blood is Oceans you know I also like yes he's like so what you start making these ties and start thinking deeper it's all the same every time I do a movement Workshop I'm like this is going to be great for drain hammocks you know I had seemingly has nothing to do with it So when you say that Trixie when child would. Say I love watching you teach I mean that had to be an amazing point of Pride you think about like the things you saw your parents doing and what their jobs were in there were probably like normal is jobs does your mom work yeah she did always work she was like in the Airlines and then she worked for UPS which was like dark times she was in management at UBS which is like not a kind. Job and that was during my teenage years as well but when we were kids yeah she worked she worked we were at my nana's a lot but she's home a lot too when we were little and so being able to see that and seeing you being like so strong on your power and like being able to like teach it's a pretty cool thing to have for to be able to have your kid wield a witness yeah I think it's I think she doesn't realize how like I don't know I don't think he realizes that she grew up in a pilates studio like and later on in life she's going to be like that was a different way to become so I hope she appreciates it one day but she's at that stage now or she's kind of pulling separating a little bit 13 about to be 13 in like two weeks that's insane I know I know anyway yeah okay so you saw when she was 10 it was like wow Mom you're so great and now she's like like whatever you know cool you're doing Dynamics I can be on my phone plotting how to underage drink exactly she's got a rebel by drinking don't do it. She's gonna write I can't get away from that necessarily necessary items like the kids these days don't have the seam. With my nieces there like 19 and 24 respectively and like. Drinking is like a thing in their world but it's not like it was for me yeah like they're not we were way too like crazy with it and I think that I feel I hope that the mystery and magic of alcohol like I'm very plain she understands. XYZ this person it was intoxicated and this you know I'm not feeling good because this or that and so I think it's kind of like sex if you're honest and open it's just better outcome so if she does Explorer with it hopefully she does so in a way that's safe yeah whatever and doesn't just look at it like this makes me a grown-up this makes me interesting so we're working through that I don't talk about it all the time but I think it's just part of her life you know the conversation around alcohol is just there. So how have you seen your Pilates business and your Dynamics business dovetail together while many of my Dynamics members are Pilates students and I have found that I actually tend to put more energy into the Pilates business because I find that people then filter through to drain Amex like Pilates is a nice Gateway like okay I'm doing something a little weird I'm getting out of my comfort zone I'm getting taught by this person and then they see that there's other people oh you did Ryan Amex you did during Amex and so there's enough people in the community that then they they kind of filter over to drain Amex to just experiment with that so that's how I've dovetailed the to and certainly my experience with Dynamics and teaching online and zoom and marketing when the pandemic struck and I lost my job I popped up this virtual studio for my Pilates classes and I was able to get up there. The second. I was also on the board at school so I know we were shutting down like a few days before we did and private usually shuts down before public and so I thought it was just gonna be like two weeks to a month popped up I was teaching like 16 classes a week because I was trying to like hustle when the pandemic started the averaging 16 class and where pretty full because people were definitely yeah I was doing great I paid out I'd so much credit card debt I paid off like within a couple months and then you know everybody started doing it and the pandemic was good for you so it was great for me the pandemic as far as business goes and even life I mean I'm not somebody I hate it sounds really privileged or something and I feel bad I feel badly about everything that has happened but I've had a lot of roughness. So in a way like having my kid at home she's old enough where the zoom school was actually something she thrived in and being able to be at home and teach and not race around the city trying to get the pieces of the puzzle together it was it was a breath and because I had this experience with the online world I was well positioned I felt like finally I'm actually like in a good spot when something happens and of course there was a lot of stress in different ways around the pandemic but my life actually was less stressful as a whole when it came and financially better so I was able to capitalize on that and now I've just kind of built them into this whole studio so drain Amex is this like plus like you want to come in you want to do Pilates you want to meditate hey you want to take 90 days and go a little bit deeper and spend a little more time together and get with a group of peers and really tease out what's happening and really anybody that's drinking even a couple times a month can benefit from drain Amex it's not for somebody who feels powerless and feels addicted to alcohol who feels they're not making a choice to drink it's not that for you it's for that kind of gray area Drinker that's just going why do I keep doing this why do I keep doing this. So Panic hits you doing 16 classes a week is that sustainable no no. No it was fine I mean I was like I was in Hustle mode and that is a dysfunction of mine and so then I analyzed what classes actually were the most consistent and I was like a butt kicker Fitness lady Pilates teacher in the studio and what I noticed I had this this mellower class that was just 30 minutes and that I just I didn't push really hard in it we just kind of explored and those people were really consistent they were coming every day and it was something I could do every day without harming my body and what was the class groundwork that's called groundwork and so I decided to go all in on groundwork I booked that twice twice a day I taught twice a day and it's continue to grow and that's kind of the foundation of my business is not to replace your Peloton not to replace your weightlifting do all those things but what about every day are you just taking one but kicking class a week. I do get sound like brushing your teeth you should be feeling fuzzy in your teeth you should be feeling fuzzy in your body and remedy that with 30 minutes on the floor roll around we have some fun you see the people it's a tight-knit community that comes regularly and it's great and people are seeing amazing results and there are getting injured less or recovering from their injuries faster they're feeling better and just the way they move around in their life they're getting better at their sports or there you'll go or their Peloton and it's interesting because you know I've taken a couple of your grammar classes in there and they are there's they start off really easy and I think that you know it's like. My sister and I talked about this where it's like you know I don't want to like waste like I look I do like a like a Peloton classes little bit easier mad because I could have taken a harder class maybe because I would have earned I would have burned 37 more calories and it would have liked made this huge deal and it's like you unless you are hurting or sweating or heaving or whatever at the end of a class doesn't feel like it was worth it and those are the classes where you

00 a.m. and noon 8 a.m. and noon Central and it's like you either like a thing you do like. Before you leave you'll get ready to go to work or like during your lunch break or whatever yeah like it's not like you're going to wreck your outfit like just just or your hair maybe gotta change your clothes but you're not going to get covered in sweat and you know again how movement is like life what is our mentality with a work day if I don't produce the maximum amount I'm some kind of lazy slob that doesn't try hard that's not sustainable we know all the you know the evils of capitalist thinking and all of our programming to work so hard so as I've developed this business I'm like I can't. Yes I can I kind of want to I kind of want to work myself to the Bone and be just like just a just a donkey and I'm like you know that's not what I'm trying to preach that's not the way to live so I need to trust that I can also be easy in my business and it will grow and it will sustain I don't have to think about scaling every minute of every day even though my inner my inner voice capital is Susan is regularly telling me to do that well but I think. I mean it's but it's not just your inner voice it's the whole world oh yeah I mean you know the idea of you know grind grind grind actually I put this I saw this funny meme I put it on Instagram he may have even commented on it where it was like my last meal on death row is going to be a protein shake no off days or whatever and it's like it see that know it's like when I saw that I was like oh my God that's like this if I was on death row my last meal what would it be like lean salmon fillet broccoli and some quinoa could be because that's like yeah then you get credit you get credit for caring and it's too much and it's too much and so I think that that's really helped me in my business to stay balanced like am I having fun of course there's push of course there's hustle of course their sacrifice of course their stress I'm not going to act like I'm like I've figured it out I have the easiest way to run my business I'm in my head about it a lot but I do continually bring myself down to that place like it doesn't have to hurt to work it doesn't have to hurt to work which is a hard lesson for I think for a lot of. People to kind of wrap their head around especially small business owner well and especially women yeah and so let's go back to that a little bit is that so you you had a job. Up until the beginning of the pandemic how would you characterize the difference between having a consistent income versus like being the maker of your own destiny like do you are there moments where you're like I do I kind of want to just go back and work for somebody else or does it come from a place of like for me like I always like I would really love to be a barista at Starbucks because you go to work you work hard you get to make drinks for people and then you leave work and you've got money in your pocket and no one's mad at you and you don't think about work yeah like I have fantasies of just not even waiting tables I used to love waiting I do I mean I think about I like Chad work at a breakfast place just to like hang out and just like have a fun day yeah yeah II Miss waiting Tables by the way servers listening we understand it's not like that well I mean that's a distance makes the heart grow fonder it's like I miss like I miss waiting tables I missed like walking around a tables and being sassy and remembering towels Porter's in like you know. The fun side asks I liked a style of likely give me some side work how fast can I get my tasks exactly I'm a marry ketchups like a bitch you know like I got a whole technique down it was pretty good but I do think that part of the reason why I say I missed waiting tables is because I miss being like 26 years old and like being on 5 improv teams and like DJ at The Hideout you know I miss being young I don't necessarily miss the grind of waiting tables yeah I know I mean you can miss something and not want it back also just something I talk about in drinking a lot you know you can have that Nostalgia of do you miss drinking or do you miss being 26 is that really the thing was it the weighting of the tables that was the thing or was it that you were in a group with a bunch of other open-hearted 26 year olds being wild all the time it's like. I have this theory about Dave Matthews. Hmm that no one really likes Dave Matthews they just miss College yeah that's fair yeah it's sort of like I randomly had a date recently where I play Dave Matthews I don't know why I like I never do but I like picked him when I was cleaning or something I was like because you wanted to hike up your skirt a little more show your world to someone I do not I know every day yeah it happens though yeah it does happen I mean you'll be in a grocery store no the local bomb pop up and you're like okay yeah I mean to bring back to your question about the the job versus the boss I mean I think that it's sort of like you can't go back like I liked when my thing was my side hustle and then I had my consistent job that I could count on that I planned on you know slowly leaving but I was going to do that you know I was going to save the certain amount of money and whatever and that was just sort of ripped out from underneath me and and so the hardest part for me about owning a business it's not the work it's the worry. Like parenting talk not what I mean by the worry just that like when I'm not working. I have a hard time believing that that's okay at the time I'm like wait is this somehow serving my business right now like if your that's a minute if you're the sole income maker of the thing and you stopped too watch an episode of a TV show or something like I could be making money right now I could be doing something to like work for my business or I could be researching something or I could be at least at the bare minimum if I'm not going to like do something active I'm going to like read a business book yeah I listen to a business podcast for sure and that's something that I've just had to really like I went that way and I was working 100 hours a week and I was crazed and quite frankly addicted like there was a transfer addiction after I quit drinking I was like I'll just be at work psycho and then at some point I had to I had to pull that back and really teach myself in a new way about it's just a soul Journey it's like no you don't have to show up this hard like you are enough you are doing enough you are valid. There's no rush then time is an illusion money is a card struct your business is your is your living off of your business and then some so just chill like it's okay to enjoy life like I have to sometimes take a vacation and since I have a virtual Studio off and I bring my work with me on vacation but you know working from home and it's kind of like that on off situation is something that I'm still working that that's that's probably the biggest challenge of my job again is not the work the tasks and the doing of the things I love that stuff it's that interim space where I'm trying not to overload myself and then I think am I dumb should I be working right now. I don't know I feel like anyone who has a business it's a creative job and you cannot be creative if you're working all the time got to get out in the world and you get blocked and it sucks and then it's not sustainable and it ends. Okay so I actually want to talk to you about your ideal client you see a lot of like. I'm like a lot of like the the girl boss you know empowerment tick-tocks and and Instagram and whatever it's a lot of like I've learned how to say no. And like you know no is my new yes and boundaries bed yeah exactly and it's like I agree with I agree with all I'm not being critical of it even though it kind of sounds like I'm my point is that I'd like to know like who your ideal client is and like one's a situation where you would say no to something. Hmm honestly I love the tough ones like give me a super tightly wound neurotic baby boomer female oh it's true Katie you are middle-aged ladies yeah a little older than middle-aged those are your sweet spot yeah I do a lot of meditations with Katie and it's always like me and like for would look at me and then like. Nine people took my mom yeah and so I mean I just I have so much. Understanding and empathy of what that generation went through I just have a big family and a lot of ants and lots of conversations and it's like wow like they've been through and in a way and I feel like they get so judged for the way that they are like it's like okay Boomer but me Karen whatever like there's all this and it's like I just feel like it's not fair and they just need some understanding and some empathy and they can move through that I think a lot of people my age are like I can't deal with my mother like there's no way she'll ever change and this and that and that might be true to some point boundaries bitch it up and whatever you got to do but in my experience that's not true I think it's just. I like hard clients I like people that feel like like there he can't change or there that they've got they've got an intricate wall system that's that's Finance on all kinds of varying levels of neuroses and and experiences that are that are really valid I'm not saying neuroses as like as like your neurotic screw you like what's your problem I'm saying it like you're nervous system gets dysregulated because of stuff and if you grew up in a family of seven and then you went to Catholic school where you're beaten in front of your class and then you got to be a woman during the sexual Revolution which wasn't always great for women and then you're trying to fight your way through the work system Paving the ways of feminism I mean you get to be in your 50s and you're like I need a bottle of wine every day and even with that I'm still frazzled. And I really like working with folks and kind of D frazzling them a frazzled person come to me so. While we make jokes that it's like middle-aged Boomer ladies that are your that well I guess and Ivan middle-aged their Boomer ladies. There's a finite amount of Boomer ladies I mean is there well I mean they're going to die at some point sure yes but they are like the biggest you know the boomers are like the biggest Market out there true but my guess my point is is like out of my listenership is really a lot of Boomer ladies hey you don't have to be a boomer lady boy how do we how do we how do we make the listenership the teaching that you can do be applicable to people at most ages so I mean who isn't frazzled you know I just say that as sort of like give me your toughest like when I used to I used to work in hotels I was like my first job and I loved. I loved when people came up Upton they would be all pissed off about some you know bullshit and I was just like I just was like how can I get fuse the situation I just really took a lot of Pride and I like being able to connect through that so I think that I'm great for people that feel skeptical about things like exercise working for them I'm great for people that feel like they have a lot of issues that are beyond the normal scope of practice I am great for people that just feel that sort of like. I guess hopeless stuckness whether it be in your movement practice or in your lifestyle if you're looking at drain Amex it's just that how I teach I teach you to how to unravel yourself and so really who is that who isn't that who isn't that there's some people that are better at walking around with their masks all polished and showing up in a certain way. But there's very few people that are really like living in integrity and alignment with you know they're in that toxic positivity space or whatever or maybe they're just kind of like tuned out you know and they're tuned out back to TMS they're tuned out thinking that everything's fine when they show up for everybody else and they're happy and meanwhile they have like incredible chronic pain issues or drinking issues or there's cancer that's like rapidly multiplying inside their body and so you know anyone can benefit from looking deeper with the programming that I offer and that's terrible I know ideal client supposed to be Niche right well yeah but I mean do you get a lot of men in this program I have men here and there and it's really tough because I don't ever gender I've never wanted to be like this is a woman's thing but I'm a woman I interact with women. So it's ends up being a lot of women but I have had men come through and it's always a really good experience I feel like in general women are everything were taught as from a masculine perspective of patriarchal prospective and yes my programming has a has a feminist feminine perspective but that's also equally valid so the men that do come through I'm like you are a. Serious man what you mean by you see like what we Define as as like the powerful strong resolved confident man. Is a man that can go into a pilates studio I don't know why more single men don't do it like are you dumb Pilates studios are crawling with women and like if you're a man and there they lie in bodies yeah I'm like what and really smart and like it's a high quality pool in the Body Studio it's always blown my mind that more men don't fish that out a little bit like because I will say that like sometimes sometimes yoga dudes are very creepy. And it's interesting because I feel like the like the creepy yoga dude is a thing but there's not a creepy Pilates guy know most guys that I've seen in the Pilates studio that are interested in women are not. I don't know I think there are certain caliber of just like cool kind of like it's a confidence like you're in here doing Pilates. With a bunch of women like you have to be and you have to deal with your all forms that your body yeah you have to like stick your butt out like LM X yeah elephant on the reformer yeah so unsexy position to be in. Music. Max's is coming along your you've got your virtual Pilates classes and then you recently created a brand new program yeah so I created a program which I called the key and honestly this is. Back to way back before I created Dynamics I wanted to do a mind-body program and now I'm doing it so it came back I kept that one in the warmer and I've used the experience I've gained in helping folks make habit change with drinking to get in the habit of caring for themselves so it's our 30-minute class Monday through Friday there's options to meet on the weekends there's a library and the idea is it's the consistency we're after we're after establishing a routine. Maybe you stay with me for two years like some people have like most people that have joined me two years ago have or maybe you come with me just for 90 days so that you can get into the routine of every day I get up and I do at least 30 minutes for myself and then with the sort of the accountability my Guidance the support of your peers because you start to you see people regularly every day and I just think we're trained to show up for other people we're not trying to show for ourselves so get into the live situation you show up for other people and then you can transition that into a new way or you stay with me so the key includes Pilates meditation breathwork we have a slack account with the members we have Weekly Newsletter coaching and it's been really wonderful I've really enjoyed the people that have have come into it for this first round will be opening up again in. March for another round so my studio is membership only at this time again because we want to progress instead of like just plopping into a pilates class at whatever day at whatever level everybody knows that every trimester we're going to go back to the basics and that's when the new people come in and we spend a month deepening your practice if you've been with me for a long time on some of the basic stuff and introducing the new folks to it and then we progress to more and more challenging work as we go through the trimester and then again you know it's going to drop back down to this other our fundamental stuff so it's a really beautiful way to actually progress in this format versus just plop down and randomly work out and that's kind of an amazing way to do it because I think that's a lot of times we think we've gotten good at something or we have done it for a long enough time we're like okay let's go to the next level. Instant and then we forget the basics like when I so I went skiing. Two weeks around whatever we could go or something and it was my first time skiing back after my knee surgery and I was. Very nervous about skiing and I have a I got fitted for a brace like this big plastic bulky brace thing that I wear when I'm skiing and I took a lesson and I my mind I'm like I'm taking this lesson because I got because I got injured and I'm coming back like I'm not going to learn anything but just going to be using to give me fake cop he's going to give me that confidence and guess what. I want up learning something and and like I was skiing better than. I had prior to the accident and there's no way I would have just taken a lesson no I mean it's like we think we'd get through stuff and and coming back to the fundamentals is always valuable because you learned the fundamentals when you had no sense of what was going on and then you went into the more challenging stuff now you've been doing that challenging stuff for a minute. You have a whole different experience with your body when you come back to the fundamentals now you hurt your knee you went through. T different Pilates and and learned about your body in a whole new way so now actually you have a completely different leg and butt so you have a whole new experience and maybe you're even stronger and better you know injuries just like in life in your body you can come back better we're not a life sentence to pain and horror always another thing that I think that I mean this is a huge other topic but like my c-section like I mean you cut your abs your abs are like the they're the gateway to your entire body and like recovering from that is like. The worst and Ike it's mind-boggling how common C-sections are in the more expected to just go back to our lives when like we've sought our bodies in half so like I thought her body's in have heard of ya know I feel you and so it's important to get back especially if it is specially for resetting every 30 days but every trimester. Yes but when I when I started DJing I had like assisted the guy that I was working for for a couple of times and then I went and I did my own weddings almost immediately and then he needed me to a system so after I've done this. Four months and I went back and assisted him and like I realized that watching him do it I hadn't been asking people to stand up when the couple that was getting married was coming into the room I was just all right folks now mr. and mrs. so-and-so and people in like me awkwardly standing up and then when I saw him be like alright everybody stand up and I'm like oh that would make things so much easier yeah I feel like we can always we can always go back and learn the. It's so valuable and so even again with people like for example you coming out of your ski injury it's a come into this program it's not just moving by the way it's like you got to come to meditation to because you're afraid sometimes we get afraid of our body I get people that they're very tenuous and in the way they move they won't I'm not allowed to twist I'm not allowed to Bend forward it's like how do you brush your teeth you've never gotten anything out of the backseat of your car like but when you're in the Pilates studio all of a sudden now you're not allowed to do these certain movements because you're associating with strenuous exercise and not just with natural day-to-day stuff so you know you get people that are very fearful in their bodies or they've had injuries and it's not just about moving you have to address the mental part of it so that's where we have an amazing meditation guide my God she's the best ringing she is this mystical she's got me this thick gray hair and she it was born on the Isle of Wight in England and then she moved to Germany when she was like 6 and then she lives in Mexico and so she's got this fucked up accent that you don't that's like you can't figure out where it's from. And the stuff that comes out of her mouth is like perfect in the moment and I actually have a bad eye I've not had very good meditator. And I was I've been very reluctant to come to meditation but because I did write Amex I had to do it because it was like part of the program and I was like fine I'll come to your stupid meditation I'll be yeah or resist yeah I really did not want to go and now I'm still not a very good meditator but I'm addicted to it now I meditate all the time and it has changed it's amazing really has changed so much of the way that I deal with everything and even just like when I'm in those moments when I get into my head in between work and whatever am I sitting there putting on a meditation no but I sit there and I watch my thoughts and I kind of just watch them that's what Ragini teaches it's not about like getting them to stop or controlling them it's just like what's on the TV right now. Just watch it and can you bring yourself into a place where that's separate than you it does not define who you are it's just happening around you just like the rain or cloud and so I think that's really important because we get so tis eat up and our body responds when we start getting fearful about our body about our lives we clam up so how do you promote he's in the whole system there's not a head and a body it's one body it's all the same thing everything affects everything we have to address the whole package so people that have the most success that I see the biggest fastest Transformations from are the ones that really dig into the whole package they go into the meditation they go into the body work and I think it can still be like you're stepping into it I mean you know it's anybody can come into something to be obsessed but I think it's the Skeptics that I think because I was one you know where it's like all right fine I'll try this out yeah I'll give it a go you know if you'd never believe you're never going to grow you might as well like just try something you know and then once you get into it you're like okay this is the other side and you know it's like. So Katie you've got your lady businesses. Your lady business I and and I'm curious like where do you have weak spots that you would like to maybe Shore up. You know I'm getting to this point where my business I feel like I'm on the precipice I've got my my finger on the pulse with so many things that are. Blow up over the next couple of years and I am holding myself back and playing small. Because I really need. A team and I am not sure you know I've always invested in like a coach for a period of time or an assistant for a period of time and I just keep coming up with the things that's new to me is that employees care less about your business then you know it's really hard for me to accept you know what it is is that you have to get them to care passionately about the part that you're letting them do never going to care about the whole thing the way that you care about it but one thing I find that has really helped me in my business that blows the minds of other entrepreneurs and I tell them about this is I trust my employees. They have carte blanche access to my office I give them all codes to the door they get alarm codes they could come in and robbed me blind and that's never happened I shouldn't be giving them that idea anyways listening but I think that you know what I make it clearly this is my entire life there's other jobs you can get like you can go work at Home Depot there's a face behind a face behind a face behind a face but this is my face and this is the one that is feeding a child and a husband and a you know like it puts my weird jumpsuits on me I do love a jumpsuit you have a lot of good jokes a lot of good jumpsuits I love an adult ones whatever we can do to support that yeah. But I think that trust is one of the biggest factors and explain and I think that also if you've got a good process and you know your process and you're able to explain your process to somebody else they're never going to care about the way that you care about it so you just have to make them care about it. In a way that feels authentic to them and make them want to perform for you and for themselves and I think another thing is really identifying shit you're a terrible at. And giving it to somebody else and accepting the fact that like that my problem is that like there's things I'm not good at so I want to a source it to somebody else but they're not doing it the way I want it to be done but I can't even do it that way so why am I expecting results from them that I can't even manifest myself. Yeah I think that there's an element of letting go of control and feeling like sometimes when I have somebody coming in to assist I feel like I spend the majority of the time micromanaging every move you're making yeah like I think I'm still working out my processes and so I'm like I don't have a book to give to you because I've been a solopreneur a mom tripping or a single mom tripping or I have many hats and I've done everything and so it's like how do I untangle this. Ball of hair that's working it does work it does function but it's not going to grow unless I start pulling in some support and it's just I'm in that weird spot of how do I get the hair to stretch away from itself a little well and I think. I think one of the things I often times say in Christina can attest to this as I like a lot of times its employees they expect you to like you look I think we should do this like how do you wanna do that I'm like well I'm I'm new I'm just coming up with this idea right now and that's the thing is that especially with like a. With a with a big company where they have to think through everything before they launched it or whatever like they've got the benefit of like an HR team and a strategy team and a lawyer and all these other things and like from our side it's like from my side from your side our side when you're small and you're like I have this idea and it's like it so I do spend a lot of time saying I'm just spitballing I'm just spitballing like where I'm like this isn't an answer this is just an idea of an answer and so I think that when you are training somebody you think you have to have all the answers and you have to like come out of the gate perfectly because that's juicy when you. Worked at some of those restaurants or whatever where they came down with like okay this came down from management and they made this decision and this is what it's going to be and people Grumble about it be pissed about it some people employees might quit or whatever. But there's an accepted this is what it's going to be and like so much of what a small business owner is doing is we're like the magic is in our creativity like I'm an ideas person I'm really good at ideas and tasks but I'm not always good at like the details you know so it's finding people for me that can help make the details happen while I've got the big ideas and things like that. What do you suggest do you have any hacks like like I could I could definitely give like hex to make an effective dating profile like hacks for hiring Assistance or hiring hiring people to do contract work that could potentially grow to more like what do you want to be putting on your up work document or you're like whatever what is it even called I don't know what they call it I'm still so new in this I found really good people in up work yeah actually. But I think going to your women Network you're like women who have businesses are really great resources because they all have someone for the thing. And so I go to Facebook a lot there's like dumb Facebook groups for everything I don't like the working moms have Peloton the working moms of Logan Square the working moms like the cuz that's okay I need to get some more of those because working moms are. Like you know that toll statement like you know if you want something done ask a busy person like. Working moms are busy people yeah and they have they have a peep a person for something and I think that it being honest and upfront like right now I have five things I need to do there is room for growth if you want it like I'm I am trying to figure out a way because I like being an employer I love being a boss I love being able to provide a job for the weirdos that work for me because there's no sorry Kristina but there's no normal. Like everybody who works for me is a little weird and I think it's because I'm providing a place for these like sort of weird people to like have a job. I was unemployable I am unemployable I am I've been fired from our jobs and they've quit like I am not a good employee but I'm a I feel like I'm a pretty good boss I'm a pretty good job creator and it's just I wish I could find more people that want to do the job yeah I think so that's probably my my biggest hurdle is bringing in the team and also just getting I think getting over that idea of I don't want to the authoritative to somebody who's I really don't like Authority and so that's something a part of the Soul Journey yeah it's like it's okay to be the one in charge and have expectations and and question people if they don't do them well what it really comes watchin but know what it comes down to Katie's you don't want to have to tell somebody they're doing something wrong you don't want to be a you're a pleaser you don't want to like that's I mean that's a woman that's a woman thing that's an estrogen thing but you know what's interesting I do so much of that in my Pilates business and Dynamics a lot of like. Hold on try it this way and it's very natural for me the comic kids who you know. Our people is hard to do it for yourself yeah but that yeah right like somebody that's working for me I get all like oh what if like I wanted at a different time or you know negotiating pay and all the things I just I get a little more clammed up because it's my business and you're in at the end of the day you're the one making the decision if you don't make the decision nobody else is going to make it and so you're the one who's gonna have to say like I'm sorry I can't give you 10 more dollars an hour I'm the one who has to say I sorry I can't offer you health insurance I'm the one who has to say I'm sorry I can't and it's a in a cube carry that shit because you're part of a national problem yeah you know and it's this is this gross stuff of being a business owner that like. Really anybody who's never been in your position cannot possibly wrap their head around. All right well you can find Katie where can we work and where can people find you Katie there's a couple different ways you could check out the key at deep-lying health.com that's my business name for now deep like deep water line health.com and then I'm also you can see me on Instagram at deep-lying Health Club you can see me on Instagram at Dynamics 90 days or you can just email me at Katie at Deep line health.com and I'd be happy to talk to you and tell you more about how I can support you thanks so much for coming by on this crisp February afternoon I have a feeling this isn't the last time you're going to be here I'd be happy to be back as frequent as possible. So every episode I'm going to try to tie in the whole asmus of it all and lymphatic drainage you guys it's what I'm into this week. So I started seeing a new gynecologist last year she's at a place called The Raby Institute for Integrative Medicine which combines like the best of science-based Western medicine with. Time-tested holistic approaches of like ancient cultures it is affiliated with Northwestern here in Chicago so it's real doctors they're real but they just might recommend like acupuncture before putting you on hormone replacement therapy for your nightmarish perimenopausal symptoms that came from out of nowhere years earlier than you probably thought that bull shit was going to start I digress so there's an apothecary that's attached to it that has all kinds of supplements and oils and like groovy tools I have basically spent like the GDP of like a small island nation there so I got a couple of items there for lymphatic drainage that I am really loving and I've been so now all of a sudden and part of it is probably because I'm being targeted by ads and stuff because I am into it and so therefore you just get. Barraged with the ads but it seems to be also very hot right now I feel like I keep seeing things about lymphatic drainage and so basically lymphatic drainage is a type of massage that's based on the idea that like like encourages natural drainage of the lymph nodes which carries waste products away from your tissues and back towards your heart and it can like you know kind of flushes out your system as my friend Taylor said they're like kidneys for things that aren't toxins kidneys are for like urine and like blood and then lymphatic is for like stuff that goes to your heart I don't know 100% I'm not a doctor but I am kind of into this so one of the things that got is a dry brush which is this brush made of sisal you can also get it made out of Jew but it's like hard like. Hard little bristles and. Dry brushing basically on clogs your pores and exfoliates your skin but it also helps detoxify your skin by increasing the blood circulation and promoting like lymphatic flowing and drainage and it's easier for your body to sweat and eliminate toxins in your system so I brush my limbs and torso before I take a shower you basically want to make sure that you're always going in the direction of your. It feels really good once you get to the feeling of sand blasting your entire body which happens a lot faster than you would imagine but I also got this thing called a Gua Sha tool and it's like this little looks like it's a boomerang shaped piece of Jade and I've had washed Ogden on me like in various iterations in my life like I had Gua Sha done I'm like my c-section scar I kind of break up the tissue because like when you have especially at the C-section all you want almost C-section ladies when you get a C-section it like cuts you're having you're cutting through three layers of skin there's like your epidermis and then your muscles and then also your uterus cool cool sexy stuff and so when it heals a lot of times at all will heal together and like one chunk so you don't have three layers all moving across each other you actually have one chunk of scar tissue so I had Gua Sha done to it to kind of separate the scar tissue from the three so they all three layers of those things can move independently of each other and that actually can cause major problems for women who had C-sections it can cause you like you can't access your abs correctly you can get a lot of low back pain because that's all kind of connected it sucks guy's being a woman's the worst and when you get a C-section you have this major surgery that's not really explain to you very well and then you get a baby at the end of it and you like have to keep a human alive while you're recovering from some of the worst like one of the hardest surgeries that you can recover from but anyway I had Gua Sha done that scar. And then you can also do Gua Sha and like trigger points in muscles but what I this one claim to do was it claim to like help your skin look. Like more Supple and awesome so Gua Sha has been practiced in traditional Chinese medicine for like thousands of years and then it's supposed to have like a firming and lifting effect on the skin so it can like promote lymphatic drainage and like reduce puffiness and fluid buildup relieving tension and like AIDS in like circulation so I have been going to town on my face and neck every night ever since I got this thing like a couple weeks ago and I so I put about 80 million oils and serums and lotions on my face because again I've been taken for a ride by dermatologist but I use the squash a tool and now my Instagram is almost exclusively Gua Sha videos because I've looked at them too much. But I've been doing on my face and it fit my skin feels like I mean it's never going to do we again because I've seen some shit. But it definitely feels a lot better I feel like the circles under my eyes aren't as bad but I've also been having like major shoulder issues for like years I've been going to physical therapy for it it's a mess basically Once you turn 40 all you are doing is managing the slow deterioration of your body and I've been Gua Sha tin is that a word Gua Sha ting is that a gerund I don't know but anyway benge Arab in guava and guaranteeing I've been washing my neck and. My shoulder doesn't hurt anymore who fucking knows all I know is that I like the illusion of control over my aging and my lymph nodes and it feels good honestly Simple Pleasures are all we have anymore in this this late stage of capitalism. Thanks for listening to all up in my lady business it is written by me Mary nisi and it is produced by Christina Soren Williams and Amelia Ruby with softer sounds it is recorded in the toast and jam offices and Logan Square Chicago Illinois. Thanks for listening to all up in my lady business I have been your host Mary nisi. You can find resources and links from this episode in the show notes at all up in my lady business.com. If you enjoyed this episode smash that subscribe button and follow us on all your socials and don't forget whatever you do this week do it with your whole ass. Music.